Comments on mu-pad₃-da: lšn . . .

I've generally heard that "a language is a dialect...

2008-05-06T09:15:00.000-07:00

I've generally heard that "a language is a dialect with an army" if that's the case then I'm not sure how many I know. It's always hard what with the different flavours of Akkadian and Hittite (not to mention the whole NWS mess).

Of course, it's always embarrassing to tell folks how many languages you've got because while I "know" French, German, Spanish and Italian, I'd never be caught dead trying to speak them.

Jake,Thanks for your comments. I'd forgotten about...

2008-05-05T20:07:00.000-07:00

Jake,
Thanks for your comments. I'd forgotten about Ilya. He's certainly in a class of his own. Although your colleague certainly sounds impressive as well.

I have to say that I personally don't have proficiency in reading the differing variations of the scripts. I think that can be considered apart from the language itself. You're absolutely correct that the sign variations, especially in the outlying dialects, can be very different. I think, however, that the very fact that you can attempt to read the various dialects proves my point at least about Akkadian--the language / structure is not different enough to qualify differentiating them as different languages entirely (obviously some, perhaps even many, would disagree).

You also make good points about Hebrew. As I said, I have little experience reading RH. I tried to use "Classical Hebrew" to cover the whole of Hebrew in the pre-Christian period, including biblical and inscriptional. Although I suppose I was intuitively labling Mishnaic as RH. So, due to my lack of exposure, I'm willing to admit I can be wrong there. Maybe CH and RH can be collapsed down to one "language."

I have to agree with you on German. If it's a modern language, "proficiency" should mean ability to read, converse, and maybe even compose naturally (although that may be stretching it). Most grad students are content with reading "proficiency," and to some extent, that's okay given their purpose in learning it. If it is on a CV, it should probably be marked as only reading knowledge. You're lucky in that you were able to spend a few summers in Germany prior to writing your German exam. The rest of us have to take a few courses and hope that, somewhere along the line, we're around enough native German speakers that we can add conversation to reading and thus be truly proficient.

Thanks for your comments.

Why do you choose to split Classical (do you mean ...

2008-05-05T18:45:00.000-07:00

Why do you choose to split Classical (do you mean the Hebrew in the Bible = "Archaic", Classical, and LBH?) and Rabbinic Hebrew? From what I've seen, RH seems to be dialectically similar to LBH (not the outgrowth as it was once argued), which has affinities with earlier Hebrew. Does the she particle and lack/pauctiy of infinitive absolutes cause you do make a distinction. Besides the Hebrew Bible is pointed according to very late traditions--not according to Iron Age vocalization. So I'm not clear what you mean by Classical Hebrew and I can't understand why you choose to differentiate it from RH if you're not differentiating CH from LBH.

In any case, your ambition is admirable even if the 16 really should be corrected to a dozen or so.

And, as for my cohort who knows all the languages I should have listed Luwain, Hurrian, Urartian, and some other obscure ones. I regret the error. -Jake

Here's a record for a grad student: http://home.uc...

2008-05-05T18:35:00.000-07:00

Here's a record for a grad student: http://home.uchicago.edu/~sogdiana/

I'm not sure I agree with how you are differentiating languages, and I'm envious that you can read all the dialects of Akkadian with little difficulty. I still have have a hard time reading a lot of the signs after several (of what I consider rigorous) years. In fact, there have been only a few times that I been able to pick up a text and read most of it without help from an aid or sign list. Sure the signs are fairly easy in Old Assyrian, but I've encountered texts from Mari where I couldn't even make out a line. But then again I'm not an Assyriologist and I'm impressed that you show such proficiency in such a difficult language.

There's a guy in my program whose done almost all of the Near Eastern languages (in depth) except for a Hittite, Coptic, Meroitic, and Ethiopic. And he knows many of them quite well. He had extensive preparation and is taking an eye-popping 7 courses next year.

Lastly, I find it frustrating when people write German afer taking 1 or 2 reading classes. Unless one has taken at least 2 years at the college level (or the like), it shouldn't be on the CV. It's a modern language and proficiency means that one can write and converse--reading with a dictionary doesn't constitute knowledge in my opinion just as someone who took a year of seminary Hebrew "knows" Hebrew. Both cause me to roll my eyes. But then again, I have to justify all the time I've spent in Germany. :)

Jake

Ah, the beauty of semantics and technical studies!...

2008-05-05T05:32:00.000-07:00

Ah, the beauty of semantics and technical studies!

I always find it hard to define "know."

2008-05-05T00:53:00.000-07:00

I always find it hard to define "know."

Charles, you make a good point about the definitio...

2008-05-04T17:14:00.000-07:00

Charles, you make a good point about the definition of "languages." I chose to group all dialects of Akkadian under a single language, because I don't think there's enough variation to warrant a differentiation. That is, after a year or so of Akkadian, a student can read all of the dialects with little difficulty provided they are made aware of the variations. I don't think the same can be said of those stages of Hebrew (although I haven't had too much exposure to Rabbinic Hebrew, what I have had leads me to that conclusion).

Learning Tagalog is a nod to my ethnic heritage and communication at family reunions. It has no bearing on research.

I always smile a bit when people ask me how many l...

2008-05-04T14:31:00.000-07:00

I always smile a bit when people ask me how many languages I know because I think it's pretty hard to come to common definitions of "languages." For instance, in your list you grouped Phoenician, Moabite, etc. into Canaanite while you make a distinction between biblical, rabbinic and modern Hebrew. Furthermore, many would consider the various dialects of "Akkadian" as their own languages, such as Standard Babylonian, Middle Assyrian, and various "peripheral Akkadian" permutations...So, how many languages should you know? It all depends on what you mean by "language."

Unless you are really interested in linguistics you don't need to know Tagalog and stuff. Most linguists really don't know these languages, they just read the summaries of the various language structures.

Also, I would add Ugaritic to your list since it was written with simplified cuneiform script.

You are extremely ambitious and hopefully more gif...

2008-05-04T00:25:00.000-07:00

You are extremely ambitious and hopefully more gifted with languages than me.

Comments on mu-pad3-da: lšn . . .

I've generally heard that "a language is a dialect...

Jake,Thanks for your comments. I'd forgotten about...

Why do you choose to split Classical (do you mean ...

Here's a record for a grad student: http://home.uc...

Ah, the beauty of semantics and technical studies!...

I always find it hard to define "know."

Charles, you make a good point about the definitio...

I always smile a bit when people ask me how many l...

You are extremely ambitious and hopefully more gif...

Comments on mu-pad₃-da: lšn . . .